The Mittani has posted his apology. Which I accept as a member of the community.
That said, I still have a couple of problems with his presentation. His drunkenness during the panel is no excuse, certainly. It obviously pushed him over that line, the spotlight of the moment, the recognition, the encouragement, wanting to please the crowd that wee bit more. What I find a tad disingenuous, though, is that he was very likely sober when he was at home, powerpointing his presentation. So whereas he went over the line by naming the person in question at Fanfest, he did in fact, while sober, feel that mocking the Mackinaw miner (albeit with every intention to do it anonymously) was still a mighty fine and hilarious idea. If I'd been there laughing at his presentation, I'd have stopped the moment he opened up the poor gentleman's private life to ridicule and scorn. That shit ain't funny.
Unfortunately the damage has been done. People may forget about this dude. They probably won't. In essence, he's adopted a very public reputation he'd probably like to shed. Except that he cannot. Thanks to The Mittani.
What should The Mittani do to solve this problem? Offer a trade. Our CSM chairman, no doubt, has a number of alt accounts, accounts only known to himself. (He is the spymaster, after all.) He should offer to give one of those accounts to the poor, outed guy in exchange for the poor, outed guy's account. The Mittani gets the damaged account, the reputation given to it now null and void. The poor fellow can now have a new start in game, with anonymity. He no longer has to drag around with him the mistake of The Mittani.
The King of Space can throw in a couple billion ISK as well.
I do not think The Mittani needs to resign from the CSM. I quite like what he does for the community, for the game, and I think he does a good job as chairman. I would hope at future events he'll tend towards more soberness, and show more social awareness in-character and out-of-character while representing EVE Online.
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I'll have more to say on the Alliance Panel itself, which I think has become an embarrassment to Fanfest. It's become nothing more than one-upmanship, each panelist trying be the bigger badder meaner asshat. (Michael BoltonIII wins this every year.) Going forward, breathalyzers should be given to all panelists before stepping on stage. The last useful alliance panel was 2010, I believe, EVE Vegas, with DNS Black. (The wormhole presentation at Fanfest 2012 was pretty good, but that's because those guys were nearly, if not completely, sober.)
From what I've seen, Mittens revealed the guy's character name. Not a great move, but a long way from using a real name. Apologizing was in order. Resigning as CSM member or even as chair is going overboard.
ReplyDeleteAs for the Alliance Panel...competitive drunken boorishness generally makes for bad television. I was at least listening to most of the Fanfest live stream and that was one of the few segments I though was a waste of my time.
@Resivan I know he only revealed the dude's in-game name. I've changed the post the make that clearer. Either way, in-game name is bad enough, the dude might have ended up being harassed relentlessly, which could have lead to something unfortunate if the dude was still in an unstable state.
ReplyDeleteApparently the dude is doing okay. Apparently the dude was unaware of what's been going on. Apparently the EVE community has better sense than The Mittani, and he wasn't contacted and harassed.
Actually he has been contacted and he barely remembers the event but has the presence of mind to joke about it. He was never suicidal but simply making an exasperated comment in a moment of financial loss.
DeleteI've done, others have done it. It's no different from saying "go kill yourself" sarcastically.
Yeah the guy was contacted and barely remembered it but after being shown the video he stated.. "this will explain the huge presence of gank goons in system"...
DeleteCan't help but disagree with this. The 'line' Mittens crossed when he mentioned the player's name wasn't anything that isn't done with regularity within the Eve community. It isn't as if he had the GIA dig up the real life information of this 'victim' and then spread THAT around.
ReplyDeleteAlso, curious to see there is little to no mention on any blog post yet (that I've seen) that:
1) The 'victim' wasn't the one complaining, it was an overly concerned third party who should, perhaps, mind their own business and stop being offended on the behalf of others
2) The 'victim' was the one that provided the details of his RL troubles. It wasn't asked for, dug up, or otherwise nefariously gained for the sole purpose of mocking the dude.
When you freely divulge information out on the interwebs, I think that's pretty clearly giving up any expectation of privacy. Especially when you give it to a goon.
Point 2, nobody was bothered about the "slide" that showed the guy sending the sobbing mail, nor even mittens failed drunken slurred attempt to read it out in a patronizing manner,
DeleteIt was the fact that he basically told the EvE community to go out and harass this guy so that he will maybe kill himself.
Luckily for mittens the guy isn't taking it too seriously, however at the time of broadcast as far as people knew the guy was going through a rough time and this comment showed mittens true nature. (alcohol does that!)
From there onwards the rest of the presentation basically descended into a drunken verbal brawl about nothing, with most of the players attending walking away shaking their heads.
This guy is also the chair of the CSM, the CSM being the voice of EvE players.
The rest of his
And that's the problem with the evolution of EVE. It really has denigrated into this environment where it's become acceptable for people to freely give away RL contact info or for Mittani to absolved of such responsibility because the victim didn't know he was dealing with a 'goon'.
DeleteSo many of you guys have just become so immersed into this game that you find this behavior acceptable and find ways to rationalize it.
@Marc I don't really care about the guy's reaction after the fact. That doesn't matter. What The Mittani did was in poor taste. The Mittani may be a douchebag, but I see him as different than you're regular sadistic run-of-the-mill douchebag. I expect The Mittani to at least have some better sense, and to keep his douchebaggery on a higher level.
ReplyDeleteThankyou! It's refreshing to hear someone with some sense talking about this issue.
ReplyDeleteWhile I would like to bring up some point of contention to make this comment interesting, I pretty much agree with everything you wrote.
Arguments that this guy somehow brought it upon himself and deserved it, and "that's just EVE, HTFU and deal with it" are frankly utter rubbish. Anyone who has dealt with depression or mental illness as I myself have, understand what it does to you. Just because this guy disclosed to Mittani during an emotional conversation that he felt suicidal doesn't mean that gives The Mittani the right to then publicly repeat this guys very personal statements. Having access to information does not give a right to abuse it.
Concerning the argument that EVE is harsh and this guy is asking for this by playing it: That might have a slither of truth in the context of the game, but the fact that The Mittani made these statements at a public event that was being broadcasted to many people around the world (some of which wouldn't even play EVE) in which he was supposed to be an important representative of both the playerbase and EVE Online, strongly removes it from the context of the game in my opinion and it is now a much more serious issue than if he had simply made these jokes in his alliance chat in game.
Anyway, sorry for clogging up your blog with this wall of text. I've been refraining from writing anything about this all day and now my opinions on it have all rushed out in this response :)
@Laktos Apologize? Feel free to write as much as you want. Do not worry, I am not Laktos intolerant. ;)
ReplyDeleteI read it all. Your perspective mirrors mine.
I think it's important to note that The Mittani only revealed the player's character name. Not his real name or address or anything significant. The more I watch the Youtube video, the less I can see what the fuss is about.
ReplyDeleteTwo people now. Where in the post does it say that Mittens revealed the dude's real-life info?
ReplyDeleteIt doesn't say in your post that Mittens used his real name. But to read most of the coverage, you'd think that Mittens named his true name, address, and phone number.
DeleteThe reason people inferred or thought it was the real name is because they are projecting the idea that harassment of said player can lead to real life repercussions such as suicide. I'm not even sure if I'm articulating it properly but hopefully you get the idea.
DeleteIn other words, blowing things out of proportion.
Delete"Unfortunately the damage has been done. People may forget about this dude. They probably won't. In essence, he's adopted a very public reputation he'd probably like to shed. Except that he cannot. Thanks to The Mittani."
ReplyDeletePlease. This is over wrought hysteria. The guy is still anonymous. I don't know him. You don't know him. He might really care or...he might not. He might even be thinking, "Great now I can use this to get some revenge on the Mittani!"
He can sell his character, probably for quite a bit now that he is "famous", and buy a character with an equal skill level and then move on and resume his anonymous in game existence...if he wants too.
"Actually he has been contacted and he barely remembers the event but has the presence of mind to joke about it. He was never suicidal but simply making an exasperated comment in a moment of financial loss."
This. FFS people, it is quite common for people to say, "Oh I could just kill him...." in relation to an embarrassing moment, a major mistake some one close has done, etc. Hell I've joked about when my son was a toddler, "Now I know why some animals eat their young." Was I really thinking of eating my son? Don't be stupid.
Everyone has assumed this guy was depressed. Was he really? Who here is a psychologist or psychiatrist and how good are your at diagnosing a person over the internet and via a few e-mails? I think most mental health professionals would be very cautious about such things.
In fact, all these "concerned people" are spreading this idea that he IS mentally unstable. Or at least was. How might f*cking nice of you jackasses.
Maybe you people should have a good long look in the mirror before you run around wagging your fingers at the Mittani. You are using this and if anything making it worse by asserting as fact something none of us know about this guy.
Nowhere, which I believe is our point :P
ReplyDeleteThe TDSIN wormhole guy (second in line after Eve University) is my boyfriend and i love him to pieces and he did a great job and, was definitely completely sober :) i sat front row to record his presentation and to support him and his presentation came out extremely well :) glad to see the shout out to him :) <3
ReplyDeleteI can understand being upset if people though Mittens actually believed that this victim was suicidal, but why would anyone that has played this game for any substantial amount of time actually believe that.
ReplyDeletePeople in this game will go to great trouble to scam people out of isk and ships, or spew unholy rage in hate mails because they lost a noob ship to a gatecamp. I've gotten more hate mail/convo's than I can count, everything from people claiming EVE is the only thing that helps them cope with chemo treatment and that they have now lost the will to live because I killed their hauler, to people telling me that they are going to track me down irl and murder me in my sleep.
Do I believe any of the hate mail I get? Of course not and neither should you, people don't like losing internet space ships and will do what they can to make their killer feel either remorseful or like a victim themselves.
Should he have said what he said on a international broadcast? Probably not, but it's not really a big deal unless you think that he actually thought the guy would off himself, and if you believe that... I've got this Caldari Navy Megathron to sell you.